Why should people be forced to get vaccinated in order to protect others who choose not to get vaccinated??

chris155au

Active member
More and more it seems that a 'vaccine MANDATE' is where we are headed.

What Scott Morrison said about unvaccinated people:

"They're more at risk and [we] would have to have more restrictions on people who are unvaccinated because they're a danger to themselves and others." https://www.pm.gov.au/media/interview-neil-mitchell-3aw-10

As a conservative, this sent chills down my spine. A danger to themselves or others - where have we heard that before? As far as I'm aware, that EXCLUSIVELY gets used when referring to mentally ill people who are at risk of committing suicide, or hurting others, and this justifies the person being forced into a mental hospital!

However, the question arises - once everyone has had a chance to get vaccinated, why should people be forced to get vaccinated in order to protect others who choose not to get vaccinated?
 

Aussie

Ima da Sheriff
Staff member
More and more it seems that a 'vaccine MANDATE' is where we are headed.

What Scott Morrison said about unvaccinated people:

"They're more at risk and [we] would have to have more restrictions on people who are unvaccinated because they're a danger to themselves and others." https://www.pm.gov.au/media/interview-neil-mitchell-3aw-10

As a conservative, this sent chills down my spine. A danger to themselves or others - where have we heard that before? As far as I'm aware, that EXCLUSIVELY gets used when referring to mentally ill people who are at risk of committing suicide, or hurting others, and this justifies the person being forced into a mental hospital!

However, the question arises - once everyone has had a chance to get vaccinated, why should people be forced to get vaccinated in order to protect others who choose not to get vaccinated?

Reckon you have it wrong. Vaccination does not mean you don't get the nasty and cannot pass it around. It means that the impact on YOU is far less if you get the nasty if you are vaccinated.
 

chris155au

Active member
Reckon you have it wrong. Vaccination does not mean you don't get the nasty and cannot pass it around. It means that the impact on YOU is far less if you get the nasty if you are vaccinated.
And this means that people should be forced to get vaccinated in order to protect others who choose not to get vaccinated?
 

johnsmith

Moderator
Staff member
Whilst I'm generally the first to agree that scomo is a dickhead, lets put the question another way

Why should other have their lives put at risk just because you don't want to be vaccinated ?
 

chris155au

Active member
Whilst I'm generally the first to agree that scomo is a dickhead, lets put the question another way

Why should other have their lives put at risk just because you don't want to be vaccinated ?
Who are these "others" that you are talking about? Other people who don't want to be vaccinated?
 

chris155au

Active member
Not at all. It is to protect themselves and NOT put uncontrollable pressure on Hospital admissions.
Fair call. So then really it's not about getting people to protect themselves as if the government is acting as people's mum or dad, but rather it's about protecting the hospital system. As in, if there was some way that we could know that the hospital system would cope just fine, then there would be no restrictions placed on unvaccinated people.
 

Aussie

Ima da Sheriff
Staff member
Fair call. So then really it's not about getting people to protect themselves as if the government is acting as people's mum or dad, but rather it's about protecting the hospital system. As in, if there was some way that we could know that the hospital system would cope just fine, then there would be no restrictions placed on unvaccinated people.

Think that is what I said.
 

Shellandshilo1956

Active member
More and more it seems that a 'vaccine MANDATE' is where we are headed.

What Scott Morrison said about unvaccinated people:

"They're more at risk and [we] would have to have more restrictions on people who are unvaccinated because they're a danger to themselves and others." https://www.pm.gov.au/media/interview-neil-mitchell-3aw-10

As a conservative, this sent chills down my spine. A danger to themselves or others - where have we heard that before? As far as I'm aware, that EXCLUSIVELY gets used when referring to mentally ill people who are at risk of committing suicide, or hurting others, and this justifies the person being forced into a mental hospital!

However, the question arises - once everyone has had a chance to get vaccinated, why should people be forced to get vaccinated in order to protect others who choose not to get vaccinated?
I've said this at the end of last year. We will be forced to be vaccinated through shaming, asserting unsupported dumb assumptions("..those who don't comply, are putting us all at risk."), and fear-mongering half-truths and disinformation.

So we have graduated from those who don't wear a mask are putting those who do wear a mask at risk(of course this begs the obvious question, isn't wearing a mask supposed to protect you?), to saying that those who are NOT vaccinated, are putting those who ARE vaccinated at risk. That is insane. What's next, vilifying and demonizing those who refuse to download locator apps, swipe QR codes, or be tested for Covid-19, as also a risk to the public safety? We are now turning on each other. Just like in Nazi Germany. Those who comply against those who don't.

Does anyone remember the pre-Covid-19 days? Remember when the economy and jobs were on the rise? Remember, when you voluntarily stayed at home when you had the flu?


Remember when you could sunbake on the beaches, have large weddings and funerals, go to sports venues, etc.? Who would have thought that it would take only 3,280 active quarantined cases(34,130 total cases - 29,926 recoveries - 923 deaths) throughout all of Australia, to end this freedom for the 99.9% of the population that isn't even infected. Because of 52 already hospitalized and quarantined Queenslanders, over 5M healthy Queenslanders must have a good reason to leave their own homes. And, this doesn't even raise an eyebrow for many.

 

johnsmith

Moderator
Staff member
Who are these "others" that you are talking about? Other people who don't want to be vaccinated?

the elderly and frail for starters, also those with a weakened immune system, then you have countless others who cannot access the health system for other matters because it has been overwhelmed by covid patients
 

Texan

Active member
I'm not taking the vaccine. I'm a danger to nobody.

In America, we've been hearing about the millions of cases and 99.xxx recovered. Those millions have antibodies. There may have been a few millionths of a percent get the virus again, but that's millions of immune people who do not need the vaccine. I've been testing positive for the antibodies for over a year now.

Any spikes are more likely due to people assuming they are immune to covid after getting the "vaccine" and then spreading it around to their vulnerable friends.
 
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johnsmith

Moderator
Staff member
I'm not taking the vaccine. I'm a danger to nobody.

In America, we've been hearing about the millions of cases and 99.xxx recovered. Those millions have antibodies. There may have been a few millionths of a percent get the virus again, but that's millions of immune people who do not need the vaccine. I've been testing positive for the antibodies for over a year now.
since you have antibodies you're reasonably safe ... but you can still spread the virus to others who are at risk
 

Texan

Active member
since you have antibodies you're reasonably safe ... but you can still spread the virus to others who are at risk
How? Getting a vaccine won't stop me from spreading it on my clothes if I am exposed to someone in a crowd. I almost definitely will not get the disease again as long as I have the antibodies. What good is a vaccine and why is it worth the risk to my health?

My doctor suggested that I not take the vaccine as long as I have antibodies.
 
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johnsmith

Moderator
Staff member
How? Getting a vaccine won't stop me from spreading it on my clothes if I am exposed to someone in a crowd. I almost definitely will not get the disease again as long as I have the antibodies. What good is a vaccine and why is it worth the risk to my health?

My doctor suggested that I not take the vaccine as long as I have antibodies.

you on your own, it probably makes no difference, but if the majority didn't vaccinate then it makes a huge difference. To benefit from herd immunity, you need the heard vaccinated. Your having antibodies does not mean you can't get the virus, and share it around, again.

By the way, I certainly don't suggest you take my advice over what your doctor has advised. I'm not a medic and I don't know your medical history so you listen to what he says.
 

Texan

Active member
you on your own, it probably makes no difference, but if the majority didn't vaccinate then it makes a huge difference. To benefit from herd immunity, you need the heard vaccinated. Your having antibodies does not mean you can't get the virus, and share it around, again.

By the way, I certainly don't suggest you take my advice over what your doctor has advised. I'm not a medic and I don't know your medical history so you listen to what he says.
Before I got covid, I avoided my parents and did whatever it took to keep my MIL from getting sick. I coordinated with my extended family to protect my MIL by passing her off to a healthy family and then caring for her when members of my extended family would get sick. My family did not pass covid on to a single person during our quarantine and we have provided meals to friends who later quarantined with covid. This was all before the vaccine and we did just fine. If someone is not as careful as I was, then that's on them. I'm not ready to give up my freedom for someone else's fear.
 

chris155au

Active member
the elderly and frail for starters,
The elderly and frail who are vaccinated?

also those with a weakened immune system,
Those with a weakened immune system who are vaccinated?

then you have countless others who cannot access the health system for other matters because it has been overwhelmed by covid patients
Yes, which would only happen if a certain percentage were not vaccinated. But in theory, I agree that this is an argument for a vaccine mandate.
 

chris155au

Active member
I'm not taking the vaccine. I'm a danger to nobody.

In America, we've been hearing about the millions of cases and 99.xxx recovered. Those millions have antibodies. There may have been a few millionths of a percent get the virus again, but that's millions of immune people who do not need the vaccine. I've been testing positive for the antibodies for over a year now.
Is it possible that the hospitals could be overwhelmed?

Any spikes are more likely due to people assuming they are immune to covid after getting the "vaccine" and then spreading it around to their vulnerable friends.
Which would mean that the vaccine is useless.
 

chris155au

Active member
Before I got covid, I avoided my parents and did whatever it took to keep my MIL from getting sick. I coordinated with my extended family to protect my MIL by passing her off to a healthy family and then caring for her when members of my extended family would get sick. My family did not pass covid on to a single person during our quarantine and we have provided meals to friends who later quarantined with covid. This was all before the vaccine and we did just fine. If someone is not as careful as I was, then that's on them. I'm not ready to give up my freedom for someone else's fear.
"MIL?"
 
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