Tesla is kicking everyone's fossil fooled arse goodbye!

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Re: Tesla is kicking everyone's fossil fooled arse goodbye!

Postby HBS Guy » 29 Apr 2018, 11:51

The ones that ran down Port Rd could drive in any lane, mostly of course middle lane then move to the left lane to a bus stop.

With the Libs in power any moves to switch to renewable energy will be put on hold, like the virtual power station idea. Its time will come tho.
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Re: Tesla is kicking everyone's fossil fooled arse goodbye!

Postby MilesAway » 29 Apr 2018, 13:49

Dax wrote:
MilesAway wrote: Would you have a link or reference to the claim that electric vehicles now have a range of 1000kms?


How many links do you want, ignorance is bliss for deniers of reality. But in reality, that ignorance is a representation of evolutionary status.

http://reneweconomy.com.au/australian-a ... rge-39659/

https://mashable.com/2017/09/20/proterr ... ge-record/

https://electrek.co/2017/08/04/a-tesla- ... le-charge/

Well, I'm not a denier: I just haven't been made privy to the claim.

It's called advertising.... I think electric cars really need to amp up their advertising if they want the public to be informed!
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Re: Tesla is kicking everyone's fossil fooled arse goodbye!

Postby DonDeeHippy » 29 Apr 2018, 17:52

MilesAway wrote:
Dax wrote:
MilesAway wrote: Would you have a link or reference to the claim that electric vehicles now have a range of 1000kms?


How many links do you want, ignorance is bliss for deniers of reality. But in reality, that ignorance is a representation of evolutionary status.

http://reneweconomy.com.au/australian-a ... rge-39659/

https://mashable.com/2017/09/20/proterr ... ge-record/

https://electrek.co/2017/08/04/a-tesla- ... le-charge/

Well, I'm not a denier: I just haven't been made privy to the claim.

It's called advertising.... I think electric cars really need to amp up their advertising if they want the public to be informed!


Tesla and a few Chinese companies r the only all electric car companies , so if a company sells a ice one and makes money they aren’t going to advertise a ev unfortunately
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Re: Tesla is kicking everyone's fossil fooled arse goodbye!

Postby HBS Guy » 29 Apr 2018, 20:33

And that attitude is going to see some big old car makers go broke.

Remember Kodak. They could have invested in digital photography. Where is it now?
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Re: Tesla is kicking everyone's fossil fooled arse goodbye!

Postby DonDeeHippy » 30 Apr 2018, 09:24

Id been quoting that the Model S could do 500km's a lot when ppl start about ranges of EV's
but I just noticed it's actually 600kms , well 594km range, damn , with the supercharger at 120kw's that's 1000km's for the day with a 35 min break in the middle, I think Melbourne to Sydney is 940 km's and now the supercharger network goes from Adelaide to Brissy
https://www.tesla.com/en_AU/models
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Re: Tesla is kicking everyone's fossil fooled arse goodbye!

Postby HBS Guy » 30 Apr 2018, 10:07

I have driven twice to Melbourne (to catch the ferry to Tassie) in the last two years and each time I wish I had an EV. A 30 minute break for lunch, a walk etc is beneficial when driving over 700Km in 8-9 hours (with refuelling breaks, stops for lunch, to get the kinks out etc) so a 20–30 minute recharge break is OK with me. Next time I do the drive is in September.
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Re: Tesla is kicking everyone's fossil fooled arse goodbye!

Postby MilesAway » 30 Apr 2018, 14:08

DonDeeHippy wrote:
MilesAway wrote:
Dax wrote:
MilesAway wrote: Would you have a link or reference to the claim that electric vehicles now have a range of 1000kms?


How many links do you want, ignorance is bliss for deniers of reality. But in reality, that ignorance is a representation of evolutionary status.

http://reneweconomy.com.au/australian-a ... rge-39659/

https://mashable.com/2017/09/20/proterr ... ge-record/

https://electrek.co/2017/08/04/a-tesla- ... le-charge/

Well, I'm not a denier: I just haven't been made privy to the claim.

It's called advertising.... I think electric cars really need to amp up their advertising if they want the public to be informed!


Tesla and a few Chinese companies r the only all electric car companies , so if a company sells a ice one and makes money they aren’t going to advertise a ev unfortunately

True, but my missive still stands!
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Re: Tesla is kicking everyone's fossil fooled arse goodbye!

Postby MilesAway » 30 Apr 2018, 14:09

HBS Guy wrote:And that attitude is going to see some big old car makers go broke.

Remember Kodak. They could have invested in digital photography. Where is it now?

Exactly,... this is why they are changing.... the tide is changing.

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Re: Tesla is kicking everyone's fossil fooled arse goodbye!

Postby MilesAway » 30 Apr 2018, 14:10

DonDeeHippy wrote:Id been quoting that the Model S could do 500km's a lot when ppl start about ranges of EV's
but I just noticed it's actually 600kms , well 594km range, damn , with the supercharger at 120kw's that's 1000km's for the day with a 35 min break in the middle, I think Melbourne to Sydney is 940 km's and now the supercharger network goes from Adelaide to Brissy
https://www.tesla.com/en_AU/models

GO DON :buddy :buddy :buddy :buddy
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Re: Tesla is kicking everyone's fossil fooled arse goodbye!

Postby MilesAway » 30 Apr 2018, 14:13

HBS Guy wrote:I have driven twice to Melbourne (to catch the ferry to Tassie) in the last two years and each time I wish I had an EV. A 30 minute break for lunch, a walk etc is beneficial when driving over 700Km in 8-9 hours (with refuelling breaks, stops for lunch, to get the kinks out etc) so a 20–30 minute recharge break is OK with me. Next time I do the drive is in September.

THIS IS SPEAKING IN PLAIN COMMON SENSE TERMS!

THE BUSINESS CASE IS MORE THAN SOLID.... the enterprise will be there: no doubt!

The rest is just fossil fueled profits clinging on to a good deal: hey, why the hell not- government intervention is difficult to pull back as mixed market economies develop around them. It's not like fossil fuels didn't help civilisation.... it's just diminishing returns are being realised.
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Re: Tesla is kicking everyone's fossil fooled arse goodbye!

Postby HBS Guy » 30 Apr 2018, 15:02

Tesla has about 400,000 orders for the Model 3 alone. Advertising is not the problem.

We need a reasonable amount of EVs out there then the advantages will become clear, like the super acceleration EVs have, 0–100kmh in 2point something seconds!
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Re: Tesla is kicking everyone's fossil fooled arse goodbye!

Postby MilesAway » 30 Apr 2018, 16:21

HBS Guy wrote:Tesla has about 400,000 orders for the Model 3 alone. Advertising is not the problem.

We need a reasonable amount of EVs out there then the advantages will become clear, like the super acceleration EVs have, 0–100kmh in 2point something seconds!

Advertising might not be the problem for Tesla but I'm talking about the industry as a whole.

They can't complain they don't have sales if they don't advertise their wares, can they?
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Re: Tesla is kicking everyone's fossil fooled arse goodbye!

Postby HBS Guy » 30 Apr 2018, 16:53

I really think EVs need to get a certain position in the market before it is worthwhile spending much money on advertising and there are enough early adopters to get there.
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Re: Tesla is kicking everyone's fossil fooled arse goodbye!

Postby MilesAway » 30 Apr 2018, 17:57

HBS Guy wrote:I really think EVs need to get a certain position in the market before it is worthwhile spending much money on advertising and there are enough early adopters to get there.

I think that is the current state of play, yes. Stagnation is close to death however so that situation can't remain for too long. There must be movement.... sink or swim they say.

Range anxiety is the main problem and that means the networking of charge points needs to be first in place,... and only then can it be advertised.

So, yeh, it's not like there is ever any level playing field.... :hush
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Re: Tesla is kicking everyone's fossil fooled arse goodbye!

Postby HBS Guy » 30 Apr 2018, 19:54

Charging points are jumping up all over the place.

EVs are cheaper to own over the lifetime of the vehicle. If you have solar panels you can at least partially charge the car free of charge. Car parks increasingly have hundreds of panels on their roofs.

All happening.
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Re: Tesla is kicking everyone's fossil fooled arse goodbye!

Postby DonDeeHippy » 01 May 2018, 07:14

HBS Guy wrote:Charging points are jumping up all over the place.

EVs are cheaper to own over the lifetime of the vehicle. If you have solar panels you can at least partially charge the car free of charge. Car parks increasingly have hundreds of panels on their roofs.

All happening.


The overall price isn't cheaper yet, well in Australia anyway our huge price for electricity and even bigger mark up of cars it wont happen for awhile.
The hyundia kona realised next year will be 20000 dollars more than the ICE version, I think I worked out it would be 400000km before it broke even with lower maintenance.
Toyota have been doing a little solar panel connected to a fan in the cabin to blow hot air out and keep the inside cooler for years, all vehicles should have this.
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Re: Tesla is kicking everyone's fossil fooled arse goodbye!

Postby DonDeeHippy » 01 May 2018, 07:15

Here is a Limo company in Sydney doing well with Tesla vehicles with no Government support and directly competing with ICE vehicles. People in Sydney should be able to breath a little bit easier now.
https://cleantechnica.com/2018/04/29/tesla-limo-service-passes-1-million-kilomet...
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Re: Tesla is kicking everyone's fossil fooled arse goodbye!

Postby HBS Guy » 01 May 2018, 10:17

Interesting. Yes, a limo service is an excellent match for electric cars: range is not such an issue, a smooth ride, much less engine noise etc.
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Re: Tesla is kicking everyone's fossil fooled arse goodbye!

Postby johnsmith » 01 May 2018, 10:52

got this in an email today. I don't know who wrote it, but thought you might be interested


Little Different Story About Electric Cars!!



INTERESTING - ONE OTHER QUESTION. IF ELECTRIC CARS DO NOT USE GASOLINE, THEY WILL NOT PARTICIPATE IN PAYING A GASOLINE TAX ON EVERY GALLON THAT IS SOLD FOR AUTOMOBILES, WHICH WAS ENACTED SOME YEARS AGO TO HELP TO MAINTAIN OUR ROADS AND BRIDGES. THEY WILL USE THE ROADS, BUT WILL NOT PAY FOR THEIR MAINTENANCE! WHO WILL BEAR THE BURDEN?







In case you were thinking of buying hybrid or an electric car:



Ever since the advent of electric cars, the REAL cost per mile of those things has never been discussed. All you ever heard was the mpg in terms of gasoline, with nary a mention of the cost of electricity to run it. This is the first article I've ever seen and tells the story pretty much as I expected it to.



Electricity has to be one of the least efficient ways to power things yet they're being shoved down our throats. Glad somebody finally put engineering and math to paper.



At a neighborhood BBQ I was talking to a neighbor, a BC Hydro executive. I asked him how that renewable thing was doing. He laughed, then got serious. If you really intend to adopt electric vehicles, he pointed out, you had to face certain realities. For example, a home charging system for a Tesla requires 75 amp service. The average house is equipped with 100 amp service. On our small street (approximately 25 homes), the electrical infrastructure would be unable to carry more than three houses with a single Tesla, each. For even half the homes to have electric vehicles, the system would be wildly over-loaded.



This is the elephant in the room with electric vehicles. Our residential infrastructure cannot bear the load. So as our genius elected officials promote this nonsense, not only are we being urged to buy these things and replace our reliable, cheap generating systems with expensive, new windmills and solar cells, but we will also have to renovate our entire delivery system! This latter "investment" will not be revealed until we're so far down this dead end road that it will be presented with an 'OOPS...!' and a shrug.



If you want to argue with a green person over cars that are eco-friendly, just read the following. Note: If you ARE a green person, read it anyway. It's enlightening.



Eric test drove the Chevy Volt at the invitation of General Motors and he writes, "For four days in a row, the fully charged battery lasted only 25 miles before the Volt switched to the reserve gasoline engine." Eric calculated the car got 30 mpg including the 25 miles it ran on the battery. So, the range including the 9-gallon gas tank and the 16 kwh battery is approximately 270 miles.

It will take you 4.5 hours to drive 270 miles at 60 mph. Then add 10 hours to charge the battery and you have a total trip time of 14.5 hours. In a typical road trip your average speed (including charging time) would be 20 mph.



According to General Motors, the Volt battery holds 16 kwh of electricity. It takes a full 10 hours to charge a drained battery. The cost for the electricity to charge the Volt is never mentioned, so I looked up what I pay for electricity. I pay approximately (it varies with amount used and the seasons) $1.16 per kwh. 16 kwh x $1.16 per kwh = $18.56 to charge the battery. $18.56 per charge divided by 25 miles = $0.74 per mile to operate the Volt using the battery. Compare this to a similar size car with a gasoline engine that gets only 32 mpg. $3.19 per gallon divided by 32 mpg = $0.10 per mile.



The gasoline powered car costs about $20,000 while the Volt costs $46,000-plus. So the Canadian and American Governments want loyal citizens not to do the math, but simply pay three times as much for a car, that costs more than seven times as much to run, and takes three times longer to drive across the country.
FD.
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Re: Tesla is kicking everyone's fossil fooled arse goodbye!

Postby HBS Guy » 01 May 2018, 11:31

Yeah, there is an attack on EVs for sure.

Electricity is increasingly generated from renewable energy.

As to excise on fuels, I feel relaxed and comfortable knowing politicians will find another way to tax EVs. :bgrin

Be nice if we got electric hover cars—roads not needed!

I notice the guy talked about charging the EVs from the overhead cables. What if the house had solar panels?

EVs are cheaper to run than internal combustion engines (ICE) and that is with buying the electricity. Notice he never actually went into details about the costs of ownership?

The ICE is a Rube Goldberg machine! Pumps everywhere, you heat water then have to cool it. Efficiency is like 30%. Look at the incandescent light globe, 2% of energy is turned into light, 98% produces heat. An LED is practically the other way around! I have a 12W (12 watt!! sometimes that really strikes me) light in the lounge and it is, if anything, too bright! Brighter than two 60W incandescent globes! In summer—much less heat added to the heat already in the house.

An electric motor is much more efficient than an ICE one.

As to the range—600 miles I think ’Hippy said.
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Re: Tesla is kicking everyone's fossil fooled arse goodbye!

Postby MilesAway » 01 May 2018, 15:02

HBS Guy wrote:Charging points are jumping up all over the place.

EVs are cheaper to own over the lifetime of the vehicle. If you have solar panels you can at least partially charge the car free of charge. Car parks increasingly have hundreds of panels on their roofs.

All happening.

How come I, as the typical consuming voter, haven't heard about this exciting news?
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Re: Tesla is kicking everyone's fossil fooled arse goodbye!

Postby MilesAway » 01 May 2018, 15:03

johnsmith wrote:got this in an email today. I don't know who wrote it, but thought you might be interested


Little Different Story About Electric Cars!!



INTERESTING - ONE OTHER QUESTION. IF ELECTRIC CARS DO NOT USE GASOLINE, THEY WILL NOT PARTICIPATE IN PAYING A GASOLINE TAX ON EVERY GALLON THAT IS SOLD FOR AUTOMOBILES, WHICH WAS ENACTED SOME YEARS AGO TO HELP TO MAINTAIN OUR ROADS AND BRIDGES. THEY WILL USE THE ROADS, BUT WILL NOT PAY FOR THEIR MAINTENANCE! WHO WILL BEAR THE BURDEN?







In case you were thinking of buying hybrid or an electric car:



Ever since the advent of electric cars, the REAL cost per mile of those things has never been discussed. All you ever heard was the mpg in terms of gasoline, with nary a mention of the cost of electricity to run it. This is the first article I've ever seen and tells the story pretty much as I expected it to.



Electricity has to be one of the least efficient ways to power things yet they're being shoved down our throats. Glad somebody finally put engineering and math to paper.



At a neighborhood BBQ I was talking to a neighbor, a BC Hydro executive. I asked him how that renewable thing was doing. He laughed, then got serious. If you really intend to adopt electric vehicles, he pointed out, you had to face certain realities. For example, a home charging system for a Tesla requires 75 amp service. The average house is equipped with 100 amp service. On our small street (approximately 25 homes), the electrical infrastructure would be unable to carry more than three houses with a single Tesla, each. For even half the homes to have electric vehicles, the system would be wildly over-loaded.



This is the elephant in the room with electric vehicles. Our residential infrastructure cannot bear the load. So as our genius elected officials promote this nonsense, not only are we being urged to buy these things and replace our reliable, cheap generating systems with expensive, new windmills and solar cells, but we will also have to renovate our entire delivery system! This latter "investment" will not be revealed until we're so far down this dead end road that it will be presented with an 'OOPS...!' and a shrug.



If you want to argue with a green person over cars that are eco-friendly, just read the following. Note: If you ARE a green person, read it anyway. It's enlightening.



Eric test drove the Chevy Volt at the invitation of General Motors and he writes, "For four days in a row, the fully charged battery lasted only 25 miles before the Volt switched to the reserve gasoline engine." Eric calculated the car got 30 mpg including the 25 miles it ran on the battery. So, the range including the 9-gallon gas tank and the 16 kwh battery is approximately 270 miles.

It will take you 4.5 hours to drive 270 miles at 60 mph. Then add 10 hours to charge the battery and you have a total trip time of 14.5 hours. In a typical road trip your average speed (including charging time) would be 20 mph.



According to General Motors, the Volt battery holds 16 kwh of electricity. It takes a full 10 hours to charge a drained battery. The cost for the electricity to charge the Volt is never mentioned, so I looked up what I pay for electricity. I pay approximately (it varies with amount used and the seasons) $1.16 per kwh. 16 kwh x $1.16 per kwh = $18.56 to charge the battery. $18.56 per charge divided by 25 miles = $0.74 per mile to operate the Volt using the battery. Compare this to a similar size car with a gasoline engine that gets only 32 mpg. $3.19 per gallon divided by 32 mpg = $0.10 per mile.



The gasoline powered car costs about $20,000 while the Volt costs $46,000-plus. So the Canadian and American Governments want loyal citizens not to do the math, but simply pay three times as much for a car, that costs more than seven times as much to run, and takes three times longer to drive across the country.

Source?
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Re: Tesla is kicking everyone's fossil fooled arse goodbye!

Postby MilesAway » 01 May 2018, 15:09

HBS Guy wrote:Yeah, there is an attack on EVs for sure.

Electricity is increasingly generated from renewable energy.

As to excise on fuels, I feel relaxed and comfortable knowing politicians will find another way to tax EVs. :bgrin

Be nice if we got electric hover cars—roads not needed!

I notice the guy talked about charging the EVs from the overhead cables. What if the house had solar panels?

EVs are cheaper to run than internal combustion engines (ICE) and that is with buying the electricity. Notice he never actually went into details about the costs of ownership?

The ICE is a Rube Goldberg machine! Pumps everywhere, you heat water then have to cool it. Efficiency is like 30%. Look at the incandescent light globe, 2% of energy is turned into light, 98% produces heat. An LED is practically the other way around! I have a 12W (12 watt!! sometimes that really strikes me) light in the lounge and it is, if anything, too bright! Brighter than two 60W incandescent globes! In summer—much less heat added to the heat already in the house.

An electric motor is much more efficient than an ICE one.

As to the range—600 miles I think ’Hippy said.

The ice is a war machine... it made the industrial complex into what it has become. Why wage blood for oil wars? To maintain the complex of course!
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Re: Tesla is kicking everyone's fossil fooled arse goodbye!

Postby DonDeeHippy » 01 May 2018, 15:23

The price he quotes for electricity is out by 10 , it’s about 12 c a kWh in USA about a third of what we pay
To many stupid things in the article to worry about lol
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Re: Tesla is kicking everyone's fossil fooled arse goodbye!

Postby HBS Guy » 01 May 2018, 15:57

MilesAway wrote:
HBS Guy wrote:Charging points are jumping up all over the place.

EVs are cheaper to own over the lifetime of the vehicle. If you have solar panels you can at least partially charge the car free of charge. Car parks increasingly have hundreds of panels on their roofs.

All happening.

How come I, as the typical consuming voter, haven't heard about this exciting news?


I have subscribed to a heap of sites, get emails with details new events, climate info. I also keep an eye on the RobertScribbler blog.
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