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Re: Renewable energy developments

PostPosted: 10 Feb 2020, 18:35
by karlrand
Chuck wrote:I hate to say it but the only thing I agree with Herr Trump on is the evil of China’s intellectual theft from the West.

His unpredictable behaviour is his greatest advantage that keeps China and Russia in check!
As long as the republicans can keep his arrogant behaviour on a leash and occasionally pull the chocker chain if he starts getting too dangerous.

He’s already too dangerous. And what makes you think the Republicans have even got hold of the leash?
How, if his unpredictable behavior induces him to press the red button in a juvenile hissy fit, will that keep China and Russia in check?
I’m sure your perspective is in some ways comforting but I suggest the reality is far, far more dangerous.

Re: Renewable energy developments

PostPosted: 10 Feb 2020, 19:12
by HBS Guy
Yeah, we could do so bloody much!

Solar + wind + diesel backup for small remote places, all that potential for solar, offshore wind etc. Makes you weep thinking about all the lost opportunities down the years, bloody Greens voting against the CPRS, making the Carbon Price fixed price instead of by auction—even useless Tony Abbott could rescind it. Libs, Nats—living in 1800s not even the 1900s.

Re: Renewable energy developments

PostPosted: 10 Feb 2020, 19:57
by karlrand
HBS Guy wrote:Yeah, we could do so bloody much!

Solar + wind + diesel backup for small remote places, all that potential for solar, offshore wind etc. Makes you weep thinking about all the lost opportunities down the years, bloody Greens voting against the CPRS, making the Carbon Price fixed price instead of by auction—even useless Tony Abbott could rescind it. Libs, Nats—living in 1800s not even the 1900s.

I’ve been confronted for a long time by the question, who can I vote for if I don’t vote for the Greens? I thought the only way around that was to get involved with the local Green Party. Took me a few meetings to click 9/10’ths of the local membership were raving new age lunatics. They knew so much of what was wrong with the world but had a totally impractical vision (if that’s the word) of how to fix the mess we’re all in.

Re: Renewable energy developments

PostPosted: 10 Feb 2020, 20:22
by johnsmith
karlrand wrote:I’ve been confronted for a long time by the question, who can I vote for if I don’t vote for the Greens? I thought the only way around that was to get involved with the local Green Party. Took me a few meetings to click 9/10’ths of the local membership were raving new age lunatics. They knew so much of what was wrong with the world but had a totally impractical vision (if that’s the word) of how to fix the mess we’re all in


and that is the biggest problem with the greens across the board. Whilst I agree with many of their longer term goals, there solutions and reality are moons apart.

Re: Renewable energy developments

PostPosted: 10 Feb 2020, 22:15
by johnsmith
I've just been watching Q&A discussing renewable energies and global warming. No politicians on tonight so it was a good show.

I found it interesting the claim that despite the federal govt. being asleep at the wheel, every state in Australia has a zero carbon target. Targets supported by the business council and the energy providers. A lot of positive action is being taken across the country. All we need is leadership federally and industry is prepared rise to the challenge.

Apparently, even if we do nothing, 75% of energy will be produced by renewables by 2030 (i think that was the year stated but it may be wrong because they gave multiple figures over the show). That includes pumped hydro. The remainder is provided by what will be left of our fossil fuel industry. If govt gets on board and provides a working frame, we can push that up to 90%.

As someone who doesn't follow whats happening in the renewable market that closely, it was eye opening.

Re: Renewable energy developments

PostPosted: 11 Feb 2020, 08:19
by HBS Guy
Lib s captured by the coal miners. That $90m spent by Clive Palmer—to get permission to get his mine started.

Re: Renewable energy developments

PostPosted: 11 Feb 2020, 10:05
by karlrand
HBS Guy wrote:Lib s captured by the coal miners. That $90m spent by Clive Palmer—to get permission to get his mine started.


The question is, how do you manage to expose such spending and it’s implications to an electorate that’s by and large disengaged from , if not totally digusted with, Federal politics? The power of the Murdochs and Gina Rineharts of this world is terrifying. In the past we could trust the ABC to expose parts of the truth but of late they’re so scared of having their heads chopped off they avoid dozens of topics, even on once revealing shows such as The Drum.
Sometimes I dream of a daily national newspaper to rival The Australian. The economics of establishing one today are very, very difficult.

Re: Renewable energy developments

PostPosted: 11 Feb 2020, 14:01
by karlrand
HBS Guy wrote:Lib s captured by the coal miners. That $90m spent by Clive Palmer—to get permission to get his mine started.

The thugs who ‘manage’ private fossil fuel electricity production have just dumped another obstacle onto alternative energy. I can’t hear either State or Federal Govt’s objecting to this thuggery either.

https://reneweconomy.com.au/wind-solar- ... nsw-36095/

Re: Renewable energy developments

PostPosted: 11 Feb 2020, 15:23
by HBS Guy
A bit of impetus from the Feds and this could all be resolved but they are captives of the coal industry and the Ministers can’t think this through in the detail that is needed.

Re: Renewable energy developments

PostPosted: 11 Feb 2020, 16:11
by karlrand
HBS Guy wrote:A bit of impetus from the Feds and this could all be resolved but they are captives of the coal industry and the Ministers can’t think this through in the detail that is needed.

Some moderate Liberals are beginning to smell a loss at the next election so may push for change. However, it will most probably only be electoral window dressing.
I can’t get my head around the idea that once upon a time the Liberals were the party of science. What happened? The rot set in long befor climate changed reared it’s ugly head with the electorate. They were undermining the very foundations of, for instance, the C.S.I.R.O. decades ago.

Re: Renewable energy developments

PostPosted: 11 Feb 2020, 16:27
by HBS Guy
When were they ever the Party of science?

Re: Renewable energy developments

PostPosted: 11 Feb 2020, 19:14
by Chuck
Did u read an article that due to everyone trying to get to onto the grid, it may turn out not to be a viable venture.
Solar ventures are staring to become unprofitable

Many new solar ventures are simply a con job to attract gullible retail investors!

Even fossil fuel generators are susceptible to these market conditions

It is based on a low bid price and betting that demand exceeds their bidding price to maximise their return.

Re: Renewable energy developments

PostPosted: 11 Feb 2020, 20:50
by johnsmith
HBS Guy wrote:Lib s captured by the coal miners. That $90m spent by Clive Palmer—to get permission to get his mine started.


that's why I was so surprised to hear they all have a zero emissions target ... some of those states are governed by libs

Re: Renewable energy developments

PostPosted: 11 Feb 2020, 22:28
by Chuck
johnsmith wrote:
HBS Guy wrote:Lib s captured by the coal miners. That $90m spent by Clive Palmer—to get permission to get his mine started.


that's why I was so surprised to hear they all have a zero emissions target ... some of those states are governed by libs
If anything State owned power station are responsible community oriented corporations compared to dodgy private operations.

When pollution exceeds the limit, output is reduced to be within proscribed limitation even if cost the corporation money to cover the short fall.

Re: Renewable energy developments

PostPosted: 12 Feb 2020, 01:37
by pinkeye
karlrand wrote:
HBS Guy wrote:Yeah, we could do so bloody much!

Solar + wind + diesel backup for small remote places, all that potential for solar, offshore wind etc. Makes you weep thinking about all the lost opportunities down the years, bloody Greens voting against the CPRS, making the Carbon Price fixed price instead of by auction—even useless Tony Abbott could rescind it. Libs, Nats—living in 1800s not even the 1900s.

I’ve been confronted for a long time by the question, who can I vote for if I don’t vote for the Greens? I thought the only way around that was to get involved with the local Green Party. Took me a few meetings to click 9/10’ths of the local membership were raving new age lunatics. They knew so much of what was wrong with the world but had a totally impractical vision (if that’s the word) of how to fix the mess we’re all in.



Gee that rings a bell. I thought the same way,, and even handed out information at the local polling booth, wearing the official green tee shirt.
It was a disappointing experience to say the least. No real leadership or focus.. at least I got a good tee shirt out of it. :sad :?

Re: Renewable energy developments

PostPosted: 12 Feb 2020, 01:43
by pinkeye
HBS Guy wrote:When were they ever the Party of science?

:thumb

Never... in my lifetime.

Re: Renewable energy developments

PostPosted: 12 Feb 2020, 09:30
by HBS Guy
Go back to Menzies—wanted to stop the Snowy Mts scheme, stopped CSIRO working on computers, that was forward looking eh?

I don’t think there is a Minister of Science in the Lib govt?

Re: Renewable energy developments

PostPosted: 29 Feb 2020, 08:09
by DonDeeHippy
https://reneweconomy.com.au/hornsdale-b ... -on-85139/

The so-called Tesla big battery at Hornsdale doubled the amount of money it saved consumers in its second full year of operation, and its rapid response to massive network faults once again helped to keep the lights on, a new report has found.
Neoen on Friday released a report by energy consultancy Aurecon on the Hornsdale Power Reserve – which at 100MW and 129MWh remains the biggest lithium-ion battery in the world – and found that the money it saved consumers in 2019 jumped to $116 million, from $40 million in 2018.
It’s a massive payback for consumers, because the state government has only had to inject $4 million a year for 10 years under its underwriting agreement for the battery, and as financial result have shown, the $96 million total investment is also delivering a handsome return for its owners, Neoen Australia.
And it has paid handsome dividends in terms of grid security, and helped rethink the role that batteries – once demonised by prime minister Scott Morrison as about as useful as a big banana – can play in Australia’s transitioning grid.
Almost all of the savings delivered by the Hornsdale battery came from its role in frequency and ancillary control markets, a key part of network security that had previously been the domain of fossil fuel generators, so much so that in South Australia these fossil fuel generators controlled the market like a cartel.
The arrival of the big battery in 2017 quickly shattered those cosy arrangements, particularly on those occasions when a failure in the main link to Victoria caused the South Australia grid to be “islanded”. In those times, the gas generators had been free to bid the prices in the eight different FCAS markets to the market cap, which they invariably did.

But not with Hornsdale, whose contract with the South Australia government also requires it to play fair in the bidding stack. As a consequence, the Aurecon report estimated that $14 million was saved in just five hours on November 16, when the state was briefly “islanded” and had to provide its own FCAS support.

Wow the Tesla Battery that was supposed to be useless, made 20 Million dollars more last year than what it cost....
They are adding 50% to the battery early this year as well and you can see why.
We really need one of these in Every State to get rid of the Fossil Fuel Peaker Plant cartel that have been rorting the system..
Just about every day Renewable Energy and storage is going down in price and going up in Efficiency while Fossil Fuel Energy is Increasing in price and lowering in Efficiency because they need to add systems to try and stop them being so poluting, It's just economics..... Side benefit is clean air and clean land :purple

Re: Renewable energy developments

PostPosted: 29 Feb 2020, 08:25
by DonDeeHippy
https://www.theguardian.com/australia-n ... udit-finds

South Australia’s clean-energy shift brings lowest power prices on national grid, audit finds

The shift to more than 50% clean energy in South Australia led to the lowest average wholesale power prices in the national electricity grid over the past two months, an audit has found.
According to the national energy emissions audit published by the Australia Institute, South Australia has had lower monthly wholesale electricity prices than Victoria since January, than New South Wales since August and than Queensland and Tasmania for the past two months.
It is the first time the state has had cheaper wholesale power than all other states for consecutive months. It coincided with the percentage of electricity from wind and solar energy in the state reaching nearly 65% in November

I don't see any Federal Politicians bringing this light...
I still hear people talking about SA being the most expensive place in Aus for power..... :purple