ADANI- l'lephantin the ..

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Re: ADANI- l'lephantin the ..

Postby HBS Guy » 09 Jul 2019, 18:39

So much wrong with that crap.

Will restrict myself to two points:

1. Big batteries are not a backup for households. They help keep the grid frequency in the right range when a coal fired generator crashes off line. they also make money smoothing the output of wind.

2. SA has the cheapest electricity ATM. Its electricity is only dear when it has to rely on coal fired power.

Why are you so ignorant? I require factual debate: see the pink rectangle above the post window? “Politics is for serious discussion of politics, economics and current affairs.” and you only post vacuous dribble and propaganda. Lift your game.
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Re: ADANI- l'lephantin the ..

Postby pinkeye » 09 Jul 2019, 23:56

HBS Guy wrote:Arable land is expensive and in rainy areas, doubt many solar farms there.


Suitable land for Solar Installations EXCLUDES arable land.
(WELL IT BLOODY WELL SHOULD)

In case you have forgotten, Australia is an arid land. The vast percentage of this is not inhabited, and not used for crops. Perfect.

Hey perhaps some wild Camels.? We have the technology, we don't have the WILL. I don't know why. It isn't that hard.

It is the big Corporates, wielding their power and arguing for their profits. Nothing else. COAL is DEAD.
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Re: ADANI- l'lephantin the ..

Postby DonDeeHippy » 10 Jul 2019, 05:11

Chuck wrote:
HBS Guy wrote:Ash dams are a problem for decades at least after the coal mine is closed. A real problem in rehabilitating sites.


What cannot be recycled is being pumped into disused underground coal mines to prevent further subsiding of residential properties. That is just one example of rehabilitating a disused underground or open cut mine.

Cheers,
Chuck

where is this happening I know in the USA there over 7000 ash dams and QLD ad NSW they use ash dams as well, where are they filling in olds coal mines ?
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Re: ADANI- l'lephantin the ..

Postby DonDeeHippy » 10 Jul 2019, 05:16

Chuck wrote:
HBS Guy wrote:Arable land is expensive and in rainy areas, doubt many solar farms there.


If my recollection is correct, how AGL was bragging about recently connecting to the grid a solar farm in QLD, which is situated on arable land close to an urban area. It isn’t in my financial interest to be running down a company that I’ve have shares in.

Most solar farms are near urban area due to line losses which makes then financial non-viable. If they need to be so close to the load demand, put them on the roofs of housing and factories.

What some posters forget is that the nature of arable land usage could change, from being crop producing to allowing only sheep and goats to graze. I haven’t see any solar farms in my travels where cattle could graze under them.

Even before solar became fashionable, I always wonder why good crop producing land was sold for residential properties.

My parents and I where never involved with farming, so subliminal I do care about the environment but with a different modus operandi then the fanatical greenie posters on this site.

Chuck

As I said if they just use the land around our existing coal power generators we would have enough solar to power Australia and all the infrastructure needed to distribute the power.
I said they use sheep to graze under panels and if they raised the panels another half a metre you could have cattle grazing...
I don't know why you have the weird idea Solar panels need to be near to the destination, most coal power stations are a long way from major population centres, if they just install solar panels near existing power generators they can distribute power easy, even if they are near a Substation they can distribute without much loss, well no more loss than what is currently happening. The joy of solar and wind is that it is economically feasible to have small arrays doting everywhere, unlike coal plants that need to be huge to keep down cost and availability of coal... :purple
so what exactly do you think posters here think about the enviroment... assuming much ?
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Re: ADANI- l'lephantin the ..

Postby DonDeeHippy » 10 Jul 2019, 05:46

Julia wrote:Extremely remote farms bring up the high cost of maintaining these farms. Solar needs regular cleaning to remove dust and bird droppings. Wind needs regular maintenance as it is a mechanical system.So it is not hard to see that there would not be a single solar or windy farm without the subsidy as they are just not viable financially.So it is easy to see why many countries around the world are relying on coal to generate their electricity.

So coal power stations don't need maintenance ? they need full time staff to constantly look after the boilers then every few years they need to be completely shut down for around 6 weeks to be rebuilt...….
They are now making solar powered robots that clean solar panels and are working very well, even if they need do need humans to give the solar panels a clean every year it's still a lot less maintenance needed than current generators and that is not including scheduled maintenance..
Same as wind towers, yes a few moving parts, a lot less wear and tear than a coal generator though....

As far as subsidies go, Fossil Fuels are the most subsidized fuel on the planet.... I'm happy to make power generation and supply a subsidy and tax break free zone. I think coal and diesel will be hit a lot harder than renewables though....


What a silly argument most country are using coal, of course they are... It's the existing Tech, for most it was the only thing they could use..... Now new renewable power generation has surpassed fossil fuel new generation...

Many country are cancelling new coal power plants, none are cancelling new solar or wind...….. :purple
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Re: ADANI- l'lephantin the ..

Postby Julia » 10 Jul 2019, 09:03

As I so correctly predicted the Greenie types would not be able to understand a single word of my accurate factual explanation of the futility of renewables propped up by SUBSIDIES.

They have NO concept of the amount of power required by an aluminium refinery and think a few solar panels would be enough.

They cannot understand the tiny amount of power from a wind farm which only works about 4 days a week compared to the HUGE power output of a coal station.

They have no concept of how low the energy density of sunlight and wind really is and why so many thousands of farms spread over many many many square kilometers of clear treeless windy land is required to even come within cooee of RELIABLY producing the SAME output as a coal station.

Hence the lack of suitable treeless and windy land close enough to where it is used.

Fortunately the Greenies and their partners the Labor Party have no say in the development of Australia's energy supply.
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Re: ADANI- l'lephantin the ..

Postby DonDeeHippy » 10 Jul 2019, 09:31

Julia wrote:As I so correctly predicted the Greenie types would not be able to understand a single word of my accurate factual explanation of the futility of renewables propped up by SUBSIDIES.

They have NO concept of the amount of power required by an aluminium refinery and think a few solar panels would be enough.

They cannot understand the tiny amount of power from a wind farm which only works about 4 days a week compared to the HUGE power output of a coal station.

They have no concept of how low the energy density of sunlight and wind really is and why so many thousands of farms spread over many many many square kilometers of clear treeless windy land is required to even come within cooee of RELIABLY producing the SAME output as a coal station.

Hence the lack of suitable treeless and windy land close enough to where it is used.

Fortunately the Greenies and their partners the Labor Party have no say in the development of Australia's energy supply.

ok jules tell us what aluminium plant your thinking of and i'll work out the numbers for you on what it would cost over 30 years with solar, coal and wind solar....Lets see if your right
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Re: ADANI- l'lephantin the ..

Postby HBS Guy » 10 Jul 2019, 10:29

The Greens are a rightwing, neoliberal party giving lip service to environmental causes. The Greens and the Australian Labor Party are not in partnership.
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Re: ADANI- l'lephantin the ..

Postby HBS Guy » 10 Jul 2019, 10:30

Not only that, there are many days Britain and SA can run on just the power from windfarms and solar.
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Re: ADANI- l'lephantin the ..

Postby Chuck » 10 Jul 2019, 11:09

DonDeeHippy wrote:
Chuck wrote:
HBS Guy wrote:Ash dams are a problem for decades at least after the coal mine is closed. A real problem in rehabilitating sites."...........
where is this happening I know in the USA there over 7000 ash dams and QLD ad NSW they use ash dams as well, where are they filling in olds coal mines ?


Feasibility study was carried in QLD with ash from Swanbank power station on disused underground mines. The area is known for properties sinking due to these old coal mines.

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Re: ADANI- l'lephantin the ..

Postby DonDeeHippy » 10 Jul 2019, 11:49

Chuck wrote:
DonDeeHippy wrote:
Chuck wrote:
HBS Guy wrote:Ash dams are a problem for decades at least after the coal mine is closed. A real problem in rehabilitating sites."...........
where is this happening I know in the USA there over 7000 ash dams and QLD ad NSW they use ash dams as well, where are they filling in olds coal mines ?


Feasibility study was carried in QLD with ash from Swanbank power station on disused underground mines. The area is known for properties sinking due to these old coal mines.

Chuck

a feasibility study... have they done it or still pumping ash into their unlined dams :purple
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Re: ADANI- l'lephantin the ..

Postby Chuck » 10 Jul 2019, 11:51

DonDeeHippy wrote:
Chuck wrote:If my recollection is correct, how AGL was bragging about recently connecting to the grid a solar farm in QLD, which is situated on arable land close to an urban area. It isn’t in my financial interest to be running down a company that I’ve have shares in.

DonDeeHippy wrote:As I said if they just use the land around our existing coal power generators we would have enough solar to power Australia and all the infrastructure needed to distribute the power.


DonDeeHippy wrote:I don't know why you have the weird idea Solar panels need to be near to the destination, ...... even if they are near a Substation they can distribute without much loss, well no more loss than what is currently happening. The joy of solar and wind is that it is economically feasible to have small arrays doting everywhere, unlike coal plants that need to be huge to keep down cost and availability of coal...

I’m confident AGL would have commenced converting the long distant power station into solar farms if it was feasible with current technology. OR are they making the community to suffer, until they can commercially blackmail the Federal and State Government's into tax concessions and subsidies

Substation are in a majority of cases are in or close to the load demand, so are residential roof tops. Roof tops form a larger array in area, that could mitigate blackouts during daylight hours.

Kogan Creek power station have given up using a solar farm to pre-heat the condensate after many years of experimentation.

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Re: ADANI- l'lephantin the ..

Postby Chuck » 10 Jul 2019, 11:59

DonDeeHippy wrote:
Chuck wrote:
DonDeeHippy wrote:
Chuck wrote:
HBS Guy wrote:Ash dams are a problem for decades at least after the coal mine is closed. A real problem in rehabilitating sites."...........
where is this happening I know in the USA there over 7000 ash dams and QLD ad NSW they use ash dams as well, where are they filling in olds coal mines ?


Feasibility study was carried in QLD with ash from Swanbank power station on disused underground mines. The area is known for properties sinking due to these old coal mines.

Chuck

a feasibility study... have they done it or still pumping ash into their unlined dams :purple


Currently uneconomical unless some else picks up the tab!

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Re: ADANI- l'lephantin the ..

Postby Julia » 10 Jul 2019, 12:03

The trouble is the sun and wind are statistical random quantities and so will be the output of any solar and wind farm but this is required to supply a constant reliable stable voltage and frequency supply which it cannot.

Renewables are a problem looking for a solution.

Fortunately we still have the ever reliable coal stations keeping the lights on and providing cheap power.

Sth Aust with the highest power cost in the nation must be a bit envious. Come to Sth Aust and get stuck in a lift in a blackout and smell the diesel.
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Re: ADANI- l'lephantin the ..

Postby HBS Guy » 10 Jul 2019, 12:16

AGW is getting to the stage that major effects will be felt pretty soon. FFs are on their way out beginning with coal. EVs are beginning to push ICE vehicles off the roads, even some planes are electric, short hop as yet but landing and take off are times peak fuel use so that saves a lot of aviation fuel being turned into CO2 and pollution.
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Re: ADANI- l'lephantin the ..

Postby DonDeeHippy » 10 Jul 2019, 12:41

Chuck wrote:
DonDeeHippy wrote:
Chuck wrote:
DonDeeHippy wrote:
Chuck wrote:
HBS Guy wrote:Ash dams are a problem for decades at least after the coal mine is closed. A real problem in rehabilitating sites."...........
where is this happening I know in the USA there over 7000 ash dams and QLD ad NSW they use ash dams as well, where are they filling in olds coal mines ?


Feasibility study was carried in QLD with ash from Swanbank power station on disused underground mines. The area is known for properties sinking due to these old coal mines.

Chuck

a feasibility study... have they done it or still pumping ash into their unlined dams :purple


Currently uneconomical unless some else picks up the tab!

Chuck

so no coal power stations are pumping ash into old coal mines......
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Re: ADANI- l'lephantin the ..

Postby Chuck » 11 Jul 2019, 10:27

The Adani protestors should be proud of themselves causing extra emissions into the Bris atmosphere by delaying traffic movement.

The Greenies motto must be 'certain pollutions are acceptable to get our political outcomes'!

Sound similar to accepting 'disposable nappies' not to offend the young modern families and losing their votes.

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