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Re: Gardening

PostPosted: 09 Aug 2018, 17:14
by HBS Guy
Drainage plus harvesting rainwater. Will get it done a bit piecemeal. The mounds into which the trees and then the understory will be planted will do the drainage.

Also in the swales—lots organic matter incl some hardwood chips, prunings from the trees (apart from any diseased prunings, of course) that feed the fungi and feeder roots of the trees. Chooks will love scratching in it—and add their own fertiliser. Eventually—no need to irrigate!

Do a Google on swales, tons info, could be good for your butterfly forest.

Re: Gardening

PostPosted: 10 Aug 2018, 00:10
by Sprintcyclist
I see, so sort of 'mini moats' around the trees ?

Yes, in nature the ground is uneven, has hollows and peaks.

Re: Gardening

PostPosted: 10 Aug 2018, 02:00
by HBS Guy
Well, “mini moats” at the uphill side of a row of trees.

Re: Gardening

PostPosted: 10 Aug 2018, 10:57
by Sprintcyclist
HBS Guy wrote:Will, “mini moats” at the uphill side of a row of trees.


Makes good sense.

The path in the Butterfly Forest is banked into the slope, so sort of has a water retention shape.
Only on a normal backyard block, so can't do a lot more really.

Re: Gardening

PostPosted: 10 Aug 2018, 11:56
by HBS Guy
No.

So swales help retain floodwater, get floodwater to drop sediment. Plant reeds and sedge and you remove impurities from the water on its way to a dam etc.

I will use them but since I will be making mounds they will be created by default, kinda.

Re the cherries I think I am on to a way of pruning them that they can be harvested without needing ladders. Absolutely no feeding of cherry trees—they will grow huge!

Re: Gardening

PostPosted: 10 Aug 2018, 13:00
by Sprintcyclist
Harvesting without using ladders will a great benefit.
Putting up a ladder on uneven ground is not easy, even 3 legged ladders. Much better to be standing on the ground.
Going to weight or tie down branches to the ground ?


I noticed after a rain the banked path was sodden and holding water. On other normal sloped areas the soil was very firm.
So it made a big difference.

Re: Gardening

PostPosted: 10 Aug 2018, 14:00
by HBS Guy
You made a swale!

Re: Gardening

PostPosted: 10 Aug 2018, 14:08
by HBS Guy
Will need to prune or it grows to its full 14–15', close to 5 metres :OMG :OMG :OMG Apart from picking fruit there is pruning, spraying (neem oil mainly)

Bending down branches is good, use tree ties, tie with string to a ring in a post.

I saw a really good idea, will work with any fruit tree (any tree, really.)

Collect some plastic water bottles (with tops) and get some thick, plastic coated wire. Make a loose hook at one end of the wire and tie the other around the neck of the bottle. Hang bottle from the branch, add water until it bends the branch, put top on bottle. Thick, plastic coated wire won’t harm the branch. Do this in stages to avoid snapping off the branch. Must have closed the page containing that hint but will find it again.

Re: Gardening

PostPosted: 10 Aug 2018, 14:57
by Sprintcyclist
I like the plastic water bottle idea. Won't have anything to trip over.

Trees shaped like this can fruit more. The fruit is exposed to more sun.
Also, the fruit is more accessible, so much better. That will make a huge difference when you have kilos of fruit.
Can put the fruit box on a small table beside you as you pick, if you are standing on the ground.

Re: Gardening

PostPosted: 10 Aug 2018, 15:55
by HBS Guy
Better than that—the trolley I take to the Central and Farmers Markets!

Re: Gardening

PostPosted: 10 Aug 2018, 17:26
by Cherie
I am jealous you have any kind of markets- anyway I want to have some kind success with fruit trees- esp avo and olive ( love)

Image

But I dont know how to tame battle my very bad soils

Re: Gardening

PostPosted: 10 Aug 2018, 17:50
by HBS Guy
I think you will find avocados prefer sandy soil. Do prepare like I told you, get organic matter in there, cowshit, carrot tops, spoiled hay whatever is to hand and cheap.

No idea about olives tho.

Re: Gardening

PostPosted: 10 Aug 2018, 19:13
by Cherie
well I am really going to give it a go- getting an avo here will be the tricky bit especially A Hass- but as for olive trees I have seen one man here with a whole grove- he is dead now but they lived on for years until the new owner moved in and bulldozed the lot :mad want to plant peaches/ a good apricot lemons and other fruits as well-

Re: Gardening

PostPosted: 12 Aug 2018, 14:40
by HBS Guy
Came across a note I had made: run greywater into the swales. Good idea! Sedges around the outside will remove impurities, apparently phosporous can build up, shallow swales will fill and overflow, rinsing excess phosporous out the whole system.

I will have sink, washing machine (after first rinse, maybe) bath & shower, handbasin etc all running out to the garden.

Cherries don’t like dry, yet if irrigated grow like topsy! Delicate balance—and I am not there to do the balancing!

Re: Gardening

PostPosted: 12 Aug 2018, 23:30
by Cherie
I love the idea about the moat around a tree- and I will be doing that for all my trees- my dad used to irrigate his actual BIG vegie garden and he used the channel system that they used in market gardens by making a big channel at one end and allowing the water to run in at will into furrows - he would block and control the flow of water that way- it would run down slow and soak right in- he had a beautiful veggie garden using the channel system- we lived near a river-it was great life there-

Re: Gardening

PostPosted: 13 Aug 2018, 09:35
by HBS Guy
Not a moat, a long skinny pond more like.

Re: Gardening

PostPosted: 15 Aug 2018, 01:24
by HBS Guy
OK, I am going to plant all the cherry trees in row 4. That way don’t need to get no ripping done this year. Or next year—will be maintenance (pruning, spraying) and planting understory plants like currants, gooseberries, pepperberries, planting more herbs and beneficial plants.

Then I will decide where to put the perry pears—in the front garden will do, right by the road: perry pears are inedible even to pigs, hard, woody etc which makes them easier to mill, apparently. But anybody pinching one of them to eat will only ever pinch one :bgrin

Spending a lot of time in the conservatory I reckon between the fruit trees and the house a lot of flowers some decorative trees like crepe myrtle, a beech or silver birch etc, vege/herb patch near the kitchen, maybe partere with stepover apple trees (extremely dwarfing trees) separating different beds, a pond with fountain etc.

Re: Gardening

PostPosted: 15 Aug 2018, 01:45
by HBS Guy
I have had a thought about the two cider apples trees I bought but don’t want: I will plant them somewhere, keep them small by pruning—use the roots to graft wood from a tree I do want to the roots of the ones I don’t!

One could be winesaps, only available in dwarf—graft a decent branch to the rootstock—plenty delicious apples that will store really well!

if I don’t, just dig them up throw them away!

Re: Gardening

PostPosted: 15 Aug 2018, 09:38
by HBS Guy
Row 5 has been deep ripped and composts spread and dug in, well part anyway—be a shame not to make use of it.

some rosemary and fennel, for culinary use and attracting beneficial insects to my garden. A nasturtium at one end, see if I can find a good eating type—Victorians loved putting a peppery nasturtium leaf in a sandwich.

A row of rhubard, one of asparagus. Try a pomegranate—may be on the cold side but might do—or two.

A climbing rose or grape to cover up the garden shed?

Re: Gardening

PostPosted: 15 Aug 2018, 09:54
by HBS Guy
Between edge of row 5 and the house a decorative garden, flower and decorative veges: rainbow chard, 2-3 types of kale, romanesco broccoli. When I am in my conservatory can look out over all this and onto my fruit trees.

Make this garden parterre with step over apples (extreme dwarfing apples) dividing the beds?

In there, somewhere, a patch with daisies of all types, seaside, pig face, african, marguerite, gerberas—in remembrance of Mum and Annie. Maybe the pond could be somewhere near. Don’t like gerberas that much but the double and triple flower ones are not too bad.

Pity I can‘t dig up one of Mum’s gerberas and replant it there—very strict quarantine laws in Tassie! Will try to get permission to have a few soil free bromeliad pups brought into Tassie. Will have to treat them as indoor plants in winter I suppose.

Re: Gardening

PostPosted: 15 Aug 2018, 17:47
by Sprintcyclist
HBS Guy wrote:Between edge of row 5 and the house a decorative garden, flower and decorative veges: rainbow chard, 2-3 types of kale, romanesco broccoli. When I am in my conservatory can look out over all this and onto my fruit trees.

Make this garden parterre with step over apples (extreme dwarfing apples) dividing the beds?

In there, somewhere, a patch with daisies of all types, seaside, pig face, african, marguerite, gerberas—in remembrance of Mum and Annie. Maybe the pond could be somewhere near. Don’t like gerberas that much but the double and triple flower ones are not too bad.

Pity I can‘t dig up one of Mum’s gerberas and replant it there—very strict quarantine laws in Tassie! Will try to get permission to have a few soil free bromeliad pups brought into Tassie. Will have to treat them as indoor plants in winter I suppose.


That sounds beautiful.

Flowers are good to grow

Re: Gardening

PostPosted: 15 Aug 2018, 17:56
by HBS Guy
Yup.

Re: Gardening

PostPosted: 16 Aug 2018, 09:34
by Sprintcyclist
Is it the 'creative' aspect of gardening that is so appealing?

Re: Gardening

PostPosted: 16 Aug 2018, 10:19
by HBS Guy
More appealing than endless weeding or digging a rock-hard soil :purple :yellow :purple

Re: Gardening

PostPosted: 16 Aug 2018, 10:31
by HBS Guy
Getting cold again in Tassie, snow down to 500metres by Sunday. It won’t dry out any time soon so no chips delivered and spread for at least 3 weeks, more like 4-5 weeks. Oh well, the money for it is sitting in my mortgage account “earning” me a nice tax–free 3.99% and the soil will be covered coming in to summer.

Might get a cubic metre compost to spread on row 4 before the pine chips get spread. Or just dig it in when I plant the cherry trees.