US Terrorist Attack

johnsmith

Moderator
Staff member
Joe said it, John. Let's see if he delivers.
part of healing and unifying is removing the cancer that caused many of the problems. Healing and unifying is not , not was it ever intended to be, code for letting trump off from his crimes with no repercussions
 

mothra

Administrator
Staff member
Don, I think I put my thoughts on that in another thread.

If Trump had any considerable time left on his term, I would be OK with his removal from office.

But since he only has less than 10 days, I see impeachment not as a tool to remove him, but as a political stunt. The House will undoubtedly impeach him in a few days, but there is not enough time for a Senate trial before he's out of office anyway.

I don't care who the president is or what party he's in. I do not think the impeachment process should ever be used for political purposes. I said the same thing during Trump's first impeachment.

Joe claims that he wants the country to heal and unify. I don't think Pelosi, Shiff, Nadler, or Shumer agree.

It's time for REVENGE!

YAY!

With respect Seth, Trump is in unprecedented waters. Political stunt or not, he should have every book on the shelf thrown at him and be a thoroughly disgraced as it is within all power to administer.

I don;t care if it's grandstanding. Trump was grandstanding, just the other day when he incited tens of thousands of people to march on the Capitol and "Stop the steal". He said he'd march with them of course, then got into his limo and hurried to his bunker underground to watch it on telly, while his team danced and celebrated to the visuals.

I've seen it all with my own eyes.

If ever anyone needed cutting down to size. Strip him bare i say.
 

SethBullock

Moderator
Staff member
part of healing and unifying is removing the cancer that caused many of the problems. Healing and unifying is not , not was it ever intended to be, code for letting trump off from his crimes with no repercussions
And yet, shortly after he was inaugurated, Trump stated that he wasn’t interested in reopening the Hillary email investigation when many believed that her crimes had been whitewashed by a friendly, politically motivated FBI and DOJ.

I would agree to Trump’s removal if there was any real time left on his term. But there isn’t, and what’s happening now is a political feeding frenzy. I can say with absolute certainty that if everything was the same, but it was Hillary instead of Trump, I would be saying the exact same thing. And you know how I feel about her.

Keep in mind that you are interacting with one who does not believe people like Pelosi or Schumer, will EVER act in the interest of the country. They will act only out of baser motivations like political advantage, malice, or revenge. It’s a bias I have, but it is well founded and unshakable.

The cancer you speak of has an expiration date of 8 days from now, and an impeachment must never be used for political reasons.

My point of view is always based upon the good of the country, not political advantage for Democrats or Republicans.

If Joe follows through with his call for healing and unity, I’ll give him respect for that. If he doesn’t, I’ll call him out for his first lie as President.

That’s how I see it.
 

SethBullock

Moderator
Staff member
With respect Seth, Trump is in unprecedented waters. Political stunt or not, he should have every book on the shelf thrown at him and be a thoroughly disgraced as it is within all power to administer.

I don;t care if it's grandstanding. Trump was grandstanding, just the other day when he incited tens of thousands of people to march on the Capitol and "Stop the steal". He said he'd march with them of course, then got into his limo and hurried to his bunker underground to watch it on telly, while his team danced and celebrated to the visuals.

I've seen it all with my own eyes.

If ever anyone needed cutting down to size. Strip him bare i say.
I saw it too, and it was awful.

But I’m not interested in revenge. The history will be it’s own punishment.

If there was any real time left on his term, I would support his impeachment and removal. I would support it for a change in leadership and for the good of the country.

But we are going to have that change in leadership sooner than an impeachment process would take, and I am already looking past the Trump era and towards the future, and all I care about is the good of the country.

Joe has a unique and potentially historic opportunity to lead right now, and history will judge him accordingly.
 

mothra

Administrator
Staff member
I saw it too, and it was awful.

But I’m not interested in revenge. The history will be it’s own punishment.

If there was any real time left on his term, I would support his impeachment and removal. I would support it for a change in leadership and for the good of the country.

But we are going to have that change in leadership sooner than an impeachment process would take, and I am already looking past the Trump era and towards the future, and all I care about is the good of the country.

Joe has a unique and potentially historic opportunity to lead right now, and history will judge him accordingly.

It's not about revenge, Seth. It's about sending as clear a message as possible that the American body of power will not tolerate such behaviour. Trump needs to be stripped of his office, however many days remain.

He has gone above and beyond what can be tolerated. A very clear example needs to be made of him before your country can move forward.

I've hung out at the back a bit in the past when other people have demanded jail time for him. Mostly because i do not know the details of what he has been accused of but that in itself is because i find any thought of the man vexatious. You may have noticed i don;t pop into these threads with regularity. I find the whole Trump phenomena so utterly odious that i cannot bear to look too deeply. But having said all that, i find myself being quite adamant now that he belongs in jail. Stripped of his office and put behind bars.

It's not revenge, Seth. It's justice. And it's what needs to happen to send a very clear message that stochastic terrorism is very real threat in this modern clime and those that engage in it MUST be held to the absolute highest of account.
 

mothra

Administrator
Staff member
And i would go so far as to say that if the GOP were interested in healing the divide, they would not have blocked the 25th Amendment thingy. They would have dropped Trump like he was hot.
 

SethBullock

Moderator
Staff member
And i would go so far as to say that if the GOP were interested in healing the divide, they would not have blocked the 25th Amendment thingy. They would have dropped Trump like he was hot.
It's not about revenge, Seth. It's about sending as clear a message as possible that the American body of power will not tolerate such behaviour. Trump needs to be stripped of his office, however many days remain.

He has gone above and beyond what can be tolerated. A very clear example needs to be made of him before your country can move forward.

I've hung out at the back a bit in the past when other people have demanded jail time for him. Mostly because i do not know the details of what he has been accused of but that in itself is because i find any thought of the man vexatious. You may have noticed i don;t pop into these threads with regularity. I find the whole Trump phenomena so utterly odious that i cannot bear to look too deeply. But having said all that, i find myself being quite adamant now that he belongs in jail. Stripped of his office and put behind bars.

It's not revenge, Seth. It's justice. And it's what needs to happen to send a very clear message that stochastic terrorism is very real threat in this modern clime and those that engage in it MUST be held to the absolute highest of account.
Well first just a couple of technical things. Impeachment cannot result in jailing. If they want to charge Trump with jailable offenses, they just need to wait for 8 days. Then they can have at it.
But the standard of guilt in a criminal trial is much higher than the standard required to impeach, and I think they would have a difficult case to prove.

As we consider the possibilities, it’s worthwhile to look back on history.

Nixon was guilty of Obstructing Justice, abuse of power, and Contempt of Congress. After he resigned, he was pardoned by President Ford, in the name of national healing.

Bill Clinton was impeached for Perjury and Obstruction of Justice. His guilt was not in doubt, but all 45 Democrats in the Senate voted for his acquittal, along with a few Republicans. The fact that he disgraced himself and the office, the fact that he committed the crimes he was accused of, didn’t matter.

Another case worthy of review is Hillary’s. She deliberately broke the rules regarding classified information, she deliberately destroyed evidence, and she lied to the American people about it. The so-called “investigation” of her crimes was a complete sham and an affront to the high standards we expect from our criminal justice system. Some low level intelligence analyst in one of our intelligence agencies would have gone to jail for doing what she did.

And then they nominated her for the presidency.

Our soon-to-be President is all mixed up in corrupt financial deals with Ukraine and China. He actually used Air Force 2 to ferry his son around the world to make these deals, a clear misuse of his office for personal gain.

If Trump had done those things, the Democrats would sanctimoniously scream to high heaven, and they would impeach him.

I have railed against the hypocrisy of our politicians in this country over and over in my posts because I hate that hypocrisy, and consequently, I am not fond of them (to say the least), and, with rare exception, I hold no respect for them.

The only loyalty I hold on to is the loyalty to my country, and it is the only thing that guides my opinions.

Given the history, and given my disgust with all of those politicians, there is no chance that I am going to join into the hypocritical political feeding frenzy that is taking place in Washington and in the media.

On a purely emotional level, I am furious and disgusted with Trump, but I am determined to stay rational, and I am determined not to be manipulated, and I am determined to keep focused on what matters.

I pledged that I would give credit to Joe if he earned it. He was right that we need healing and unity. He also pledged to be the President of all the United States. Good words, but he must now lead and back up those words. He has got to be the adult in the room.

I know you won’t agree with my point of view, and my purpose is not to change your opinion.

But this is how I see it.
 
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DonDeeHippy

Active member
US secretary of state cancels trip after EU snub
Secretary of state Mike Pompeo cancelled his Europe trip at the last minute today after Luxembourg’s foreign minister and top European Union officials declined to meet him, European diplomats and other people familiar with the matter said.

More fall out, no EU leaders want to talk to Trumps man... don't blame them.....
 

mothra

Administrator
Staff member
Firstly Seth, i know impeachment doesn't lead to jail time. All of Trump's other crimes could lead to jail time, so i'm reliably informed. I'm particularly pestered about his crimes towards women and children. I know you're not, so i'll leave it there.

Secondly, you're seriously pulling a "but Hillary"? Now? At this time?

And nice laying it on with a trowel about Clinton. Never was so much fuss made about so very little.

In any event, no accounting of history is relevant. I've already made that point, Why don't you read what i have to say? Trump is in virgin waters. His temper tantrum was indulged to the point of terrorism. It's still happening. It's still going to happen.

You're hopeless Seth. Determined to go down with the ship by virtue of excessive disclaimers and deflections.

Well, at least i don't have to live in it. Enjoy what you've helped create and let us agree to disagree.
 

DonDeeHippy

Active member
Trump rejects responsibility for Capitol riot, says his words were 'totally appropriate'
Donald Trump refused to take responsibility for his role in the riot at the Capitol, claiming his words to supporters shortly before the violence were “totally appropriate”.
Speaking to reporters shortly before leaving for Texas to champion his work on the border wall, the president was asked about a pro-Trump mob storming the Capitol last week.

He needs to be behind bars...
 

mothra

Administrator
Staff member
Trump rejects responsibility for Capitol riot, says his words were 'totally appropriate'
Donald Trump refused to take responsibility for his role in the riot at the Capitol, claiming his words to supporters shortly before the violence were “totally appropriate”.
Speaking to reporters shortly before leaving for Texas to champion his work on the border wall, the president was asked about a pro-Trump mob storming the Capitol last week.

He needs to be behind bars...

It's unbelievable he is still in any sort of position of power and not behind bars.
 

mothra

Administrator
Staff member
Where is the word 'treason' in this debate? I've not heard it yet. Surely it can't be far off.
 

SethBullock

Moderator
Staff member
Trump rejects responsibility for Capitol riot, says his words were 'totally appropriate'
Donald Trump refused to take responsibility for his role in the riot at the Capitol, claiming his words to supporters shortly before the violence were “totally appropriate”.
Speaking to reporters shortly before leaving for Texas to champion his work on the border wall, the president was asked about a pro-Trump mob storming the Capitol last week.
Jesus! 8 days.
 

SethBullock

Moderator
Staff member
I think we’ll get through these next 8 days, but ...

If I hear him saying anything encouraging protests or demonstrations on or near Inauguration Day, then I would agree to a 25th Amendment removal immediately.
 

mothra

Administrator
Staff member
I think we’ll get through these next 8 days, but ...

If I hear him saying anything encouraging protests or demonstrations on or near Inauguration Day, then I would agree to a 25th Amendment removal immediately.

You mean when it won't matter anymore and because he's proved he deserves to be given the chance not stoke the fires?
 
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